Kent Sports Monopoly

[electricsnow]

I like what russian said.

And on another note, after speaking with someone, I've learned a little bit about about how the shop system works (although this may not necessarily be true for skate shops). Anyway, a lot of shops will do business with people like hype because they're familiar with how they work (say, from buying waterskis from them) and they can give them better deals (like giving them x number of months to pay for their order, or what have you). The smaller companies can't compete with that, which is one deterrent for the shops when choosing who to do business with. Add to that the fact that kids will buy what's right in front of them and that's a big reason why the waterski companies are where they are in this industry (and why smaller, rad companies like the old double up couldn't make it).

I just want people to have a heart, research the products and find something good by some people that really care. And I know, people say that hype and LF progress wakeskating, but I"m talking about people that have had their hearts in this from the beginning, and really wanted to guide wakeskating in a healthy direction. Hopefully, some information will be available soon so everyone can find out who these people are...Honestly, the future of this industry is in the hands of the consumer. Who do you want to see making skates next year? Ten years from now???

[kento911]

electricsnow, absolutely right on that post, ::golf clap:: that is exactly why small co.'s have a hard time, and belive it or not the customers have the same issue, we are currently closing out the Gator boards we brought it, b/c customers would come in and go "I've never heard of that", and we go "well they are really high quality boards, everybit as nice as HL or LF, and they are a rider owned co."
then they go yeah but if something goes wrong, I know (insert Kent owned company here) will take care of it then I make this face I personally think that companies like hype and LF are nessicarry, but I would like to see alot more rider support for small companies, triton for example would have been nice if they stayed independant, and now CD is going down yikes, oh well Im off to school , nuff said

[PIRATE]

electricsnow, totally agree with you

kento911, i here you also.


i guess what it comes to is im only responsible for what i buy, and your only responsible for what you buy and hopefully kids will see that it is there responsibility to help out cass.... integ and kampus, if they want this sport to stay true to itself..... Kento you ride a hype why ? honestly tell me why.

and as far as the hole return thing goes everytime i talk about a cass..... breaking you all tell me that thomas will take care of it, and i know that erich would take care of it also. So why not tell other people that who are buying boards, kent as a rider and a shop employee your responsible for explaining to people why buying a rider owned co... bored is NECCESARY (spelling ?)

[electricsnow]

kento, you do have a point about companies like hype and lf "being necessary" (as much as I hate to say it, and it even makes me cringe that I have to say it). For one, they're huge and if you're about becoming "big time" (like freaking shane bonifay because "that's what everyone wants"--oh, and I hope you can sense the fire and bitterness behind my typing because that attitude pissed me off...whatever) then yes, hype and LF are going to bring things to a new level.

**I should add that I don't totally hate LF. I mean, they've made the best wakeboards I've ever ridden (outside of the soul series from DU--it's just a fun, simple shape), but I just dont' agree with some of their past business practices, and the way they treated thomas towards the end. Why should I take it personally? BECAUSE I CAN

And to top it off, because they're so big, they're also employing a decent number of "the absolute bestest wakeboarders/wakeskating has to offer" (take that with a bit of sarcasm). Their sales employ thier riders, and then you factor in the positive things like the bus tours and the grass roots comps...

And again, the whole promotion thing crosses over with wakeskating. Like thomas said in his interview, cassette was able to get into more people's hands through the distribution channels LF already had. But I'd like to see wakeskating become independent of the waterski/ wakeboarding huge marketing channels. And again, it's up to us--the consumer--to make that happen. Just try to support what you believe. And if what you believe is HYPE...well, don't talk to me about it...because you know, when women menstrate, they attract bears, and bears kill....

OH SNAP! That's a throwback at you pirate.

I feel like wakeskating is young enough and it has the right people behind it so we can have a decent product with some thought and good intentions behind it (cheesy, I know, but I'm also referring to the direction in which these leaders would like to see wakeskating go). And with that in mind, that's another reason why the board bashing between these people should really stop. These people have their own vison of what a good wakeskate is, and they're actually able to make their visions a reality. Obviously, we have a number of different products out there for different (yet serious) riders. But in the end, they're all working towards a common goal, which is a good wakeskate for the schralpers to push and progress wakeskating. In general, I honest to god feel so lucky that wakeskating had people like jason, josh, erich, and thomas behind it...seriously, you look at the dopest, freshest companies and you'll see that they're rider driven...or in my opinion, those guys are "dope" and "fresh."

Good god, where was I going with this??? Uhh........well, that's probably enough, since a number of people on here hate to read anyway. So take it for what's worth...

[kento911]

PIRATE, work in a board shop and see if you can get a guy dead set on a Parks to change his mind, I do my friggin part by tring to sell rider owned, and I have encouraged the shop I work at to carry rider owned(this year we are trying to bring in Cassette, and Kampus, and possibly another company that Itch reps: Im not taking credit for that though) I have bought numerous rider owned products,(Cassette,Kampus, CD,Thruster,GB)
as afr as my Gate, I demoed it I liked it, I mentioned it to my parents: Merry Xmas, but thats not to say I dont dig the board, b/c to my surprise I did, but normally I wouldn't have bought it(I was looking at a 4 trac at the time) and the truth is every Hype product I currently own I demoed first, and loved the feel, yes thats bad karma, but I feel that what I do everyday to try and encourage rider owned product sales negates that, on top of the fact that whether or not you guys agree with me, there are some very talented riders on HL/LF, and as the years have gone by they have been allowed more and more creative say in thier boards, many of the people here have a problem with a board b/c of the name on it, but If byerly went to integ,or GB and made the same exact board, its rideability wouldn't even be questioned, and as far as big corps, well do you think Erich or Duane or Thomas has the funds to support a pro tour, or absolutely not, it's not about if you want to be "big time" its about if you wan the sport to "thrive", so like I have said many times before, I support ANYBODY that pushes wakeskating, do you really think Hype is getting rich off of wakeskate sales NOOOOO, theres just not enough money in it, I would venture to say that if Byerly and Grubb didn't have a passion for it there would be the scape and the water skate as it was circa 99, if you don't like their buisness practices fine, but remember that as your typing on your Windows OS, and dont even dare to slam any pro wakeskater, b/c they make DIRT, and they deserve all the respect you can give, b/c they are doing b/c they love it whether they want to or not.

EDIT: E-Snow I read it all, if I could give a star I would, instead have a part hat or two even

[crackerjack]

Well....now this is a topic worth EVERYBODYS attention. This is a very important issue. It has been something I have felt strongly about for a long time. Not just in this industry but as far as Business and Politics effect LIFE in general.

I seriously awoke from a nightmare the other day in which I was at a Taco Bell and noticed that I was able to get a Bi-Level through buying a certain value meal. This was possible due to a few corperate mergers. It was a Parks Bonifay pro model and it was a Cassette. I went for it. The girl behind the counter even rang it up wrong and I was able to get it cheaper than it said in the promotion. The grip tape had been put on wrong (it was on the top of the bottom deck) and I mentioned something about it. She explained that she had no idea what I was talking about and that was how they were delivered to the store. I said forget it and went on to take my fu#ked up deck and my assembled food to my table and sat there eating in self loathing.

What does all this mean?...I don't really know.

I know it pisses me off. Everything in our lives has become marketable. Every American has products marketed towards them from birth til death. You can live your whole life without ever expierencing any form of freedom. Sure you have choices. I throw my dog a bone every now and again too. But where does it take us...what are we as a society headed towards? Well, I would say that Wal-Mart is a perfect example. Anything you think you may want at any time. They are gonna be there to sell it to you. I live in a small town and my grandfather started an independent grocery store way back. My dad now runs it. After all the bitc#ing and such I heard about how Wal-Mart was destroying small town economies they were both happy for me when I got a job at the Wal-Mart distribution center. That is a direct spit in their face and they couldn't even see it because you have to sacrafice personal morals for a pay-check.

There used to be a time when you bought flour you had it scooped from a barell and weighed out into a brown bag and bought it buy the pound. Now its pre packaged. Its the same with every industry.
Music
TV
Schools
Foods
whatever
Heck, you can even have a brand and brand loyalty before there is even a product for that brand if you advertise it correctly. Don't believe me? Check out www.obeygiant.com These days we are told what to want. Every single one of us fits into a marketing demograph. There is no way around it. We are all treated as consumers. We are nothing more than sales to these companies.

Do you think that Nike's would cost $100 + if they weren't paying MJ and Labron more than all their forign labor fource combined?

Did you know that you see an exponential number more logo's throughout your life than you see your own mothers face. Think about that.

Marketing is huge. It's been proven. It's fact. And it works.
There are people that are so dedicated to certain brands that they get the logo's tattooed on them....thats something that will be there for life. Hell, branding is what ranchers used to do to livestock so they could prove ownership. Now people are going so far as doing it to themselves because of sheer marketing.

$$$$$ makes the world go round... we all know it. The more you have, the more power you have. Just look at how G. W. was able to get worse grades than me in school and go on to become prez. Even after he LIED to the american public about WMD's he was still able to get re-elected. (not that I think Kerry would have been any better...2 sides to the same coin)

It all boils down to capitalism...and there really is no way around it.

Your dollar is the only say that you have...let your voice be heard.

I for one will never buy a kent product. Why would I put money into a company that will put it back into tubes and skis and office supplies when I could support somebody who has made countless personal sacrafices to provide something worthy of their own time and effort and in hopes of bring the heart out and letting that be the pulse that is felt throughout the industry.

I am done for now....this stuff is so frustrating and I don't know if it can be reversed...I honestly feel that we as humans are so far removed from REAL LIFE that we don't even know where to find it anymore...just entertainment.

[itch]

Sniffle Sniffle Does anyone have a tissue? I need to dry my tears.
That my friends was the best damn post I have read in years!!!!!!!!
Esnow is right we would not be at the level we are at if it was not for the Giants.
Just a little thought goes along way CrackerJack thank you sooooooooo much for the well thought out and perfectly written post, you are an asset to the forums.
ITCH

[kento911]

crackerjack, nice post sad but true, a society of consumers to say the least, even more so than Kent SG, I think walmart is apalling, most of the product in that store is made off coast, and the people making it aren't given anything near a living wage, and the worst part is the have the audacity to parade around "buy american" and amercan flags, and act like they support the U.S. ugh don't even get me started on Wally World, what a shizzle hole

itch, glad to see you weigh in on the subject, BTW have you had a chance to talk to the shop yet, Im out of the loop, for the last,current and possibly next week b/c of the winch and school crap.

[Schmaltz]

Since everyone is getting so deep over here ...
I'll add my 2 cents ...

We that ride are self expressionists and visual communicators who have been raised in a world in which the techniques and apparatus we use and investigate with are spawned and evolved from a subculture of misfits and social outcasts (surf, skate, music, art). These pioneers felt the need to break away and blaze other trails. From suburban sprawls, subway halls, train yards, far islands, green rooms, cement jungles, and our own garages. Talented, idealists, artists, and athletes, for the love of inner solace that comes from these black arts. Exchanged by the progression of the self thru often times painful trial and error. Courage and Achievements set the bar for self/others to conquer and raise to the next, to push on and against -- end on end, level over level. These bloody roots are fueled and pushed on by skinned knees, broken bones, and dreams. The drive within our hearts brought out of adolescent angst transforming and freeing us on to adults... giving us eyes to view and draw lines few venture or will ever see. This lifestyle binds friends and foe alike, with our own languages, spoken world wide. The process the journey emancipates and propitiate us in our rites of spring.

Some of us here on Wakeskating.com are purist in intention and strive for the roots and foundations only because we understand what the impetus handed us, from the beginning to the core held fast within our heart of hearts.

There are pursuits more worthy of such dissidence and unrest, but these are our own boundaries and fronts to explore and realize. Many cultural interventions, social marketing campaigns, books, magazines, exhibitions, educational tools, television programs, films all tools to prove our points and in turn now work against all that it originally stood for and against. We are a new demographic -- a statistical chart hung on corporate walls -- just a number, numbered and checked.

I propose a reversal... a new priority in favor of a more useful, lasting and democratic form of communication -- a mind shift away from product marketing and toward the exploration of self and production of a new kind of meaning one that can't be bought or sold. The scope of debate is bounding and grayed... most will scoff at I say out of fear of themselves, shrinking and conforming; we must expand and free. Consumerism is running uncontested; it must be challenged by other perspectives expressed, in part through the visual languages and resources of design and conquer, adapt and destroy, lets bring back that which it originally once stood for. The cultural decline of our sports is self mockery, and is now becoming a crock pot or marketing soup which cares only for the fisters who want to spoon your cash. I say move beyond this -- push past, pick up and step back... look at our history and respect our founders’ intentions. The original attitude and drive would be spitting in the face of these fat cats. Let’s repair the foundation our forefathers made... adopt a DIY (do it yourself) attitude and know your own spirit’s reward. Bring on your own steez... follow your own dreams, or just assimilate and drive the global market bringing our Art form down with it. This is not some Punk movement, or an Anarchist's soap box, or even a marketing ploy... I ask only to search within... draw your own lines and set your own place.

Freedom... Progression... Self Awareness... Unbreakable Spirit. Here or there -- question everything everywhere, especially the inane ramblings this manifesto brings. If you find nothing here, find it elsewhere but never stop looking and never give up. This is about life.

***

[PIRATE]

theres not even a smiley face to show what im thinking right know and im not smart enought to put it in words so if you combine these( ) thats about what im thinking

re read the last few sentences starting with "lets repair" i swear you cant help but be like "hell yeah thats what its about"


super good post schmaltz

[Grouch]

Pirate,

Uh, you have some brown stuff on your nose and I think its schmaltz's ass.


Schmaltz,

Truely spoken, very nice and props go out.

[Vance Collins]

Grouch,

There's also some stuff from Ryan's ass too.

[andystrawn]

I'm sure hyperlite and LF will have something similar sooner or later. Twin tip wakeboards, highwarp wakeboard bindings, concave wooden wakeskates, they all started with one company or another, why not the bi level?

Want to support the independent companies? buy thier stuff, that's what I do.

[rukusrider103]

andystrawn, that has nothing to do with my ass

[PIRATE]

Grouch, vance, yeah i new that was coming.


but it was still good anyway.

[Vance Collins]

PIRATE,

Your welcome!

[Grouch]

Pirate,

It was inevitable.

[andystrawn]

rukusrider103, I never said anything about your ass, that was the message above mine, I was just addressing the original idea this thread was about: other companies copying the bi level.

[rukusrider103]

hahaha i know, thats why i said what you posted wasnt about my ass

[hpdvs]

First off, this topic has many good posts supporting rider owned and trying to get oblivious people to understand the point of big companies. But when it comes down to it, it's that persons choice, hopefully they'll make the "right" choice, but then again the wrong choice in your opinion could be the right choice in there mind. What I'm trying to get across is it is all personal opinion, and in my opinion rider owned companies are better. But wait, aren't Hyperlite and Liquid Force Mainly controlled by riders or former riders??? Again, I'm trying to stress the point of personal choice, yes people can be influenced by you or me, but it is ultimately there choice.
And one other thing, people trying to force product down your throat in every thred is over kill, in my opinion. And frankly, being the son of a very wealthy and successful buissnesman, I know the in's and out's of buissness. My father didn't do anything in the water sports field, but when it comes down to it buisness is buissness. Back to my point, at one point this winter I serioulsy considered not purchasing an Integrity board due to the assertivness(sp) of one particular person. But frankly, Pirate I fiznackling love you to death. But I came to my OWN decision and decided to help a good guy out.
Sorry about that fiznackling rant I just laid down, I just got back from Goverment and was feeling "free". But what I'm trying to stress is people are going to buy from Hyperlite/big companies regardless. AND IT IS THERE CHOICE. Atleast respect there decision even If you hate that person to fiznackling death.